I stood in a dumbfounded stupor. Redding Reloading Equipment has added a New 3-Die Set for the 300 HAMRa bottleneck cartridge based on a modified .223 Remington case necked up to 30-caliber. For 43 years Ive read so many detailed reports men who were mauled after grizzlies were shot, I almost cant count em all. Does anybody, anywhere, have any idea what Hank means? He was about ten feet away coming up and over the initial log that I had tripped over. Youre not. I wonder what Larry Kelly would have to say about the negative talk here about the Magnaport Stalker handguns that his company builtand he took to Alaska and the African continent to do his testing with it way back in the late 70s or 80s. I mention this one because of its immense stopping power at extremely close distances. Think about it. The .45 Long Colt revolver (or just Colt) fired a larger diameter bullet, with greater weight, and a significantly higher velocity than the .38 Long Colt, or even todays .38 special standard loads. Yes, a 44 Magnum is capable of killing a bear, although it is not recommended as a bear defense arms. Take a deep breath and realize this is an anonymous Internet forum. Sorry Scotty, but you missed again. of energy, while 1,000 ft/lbs is considered the minimum for a bear hunting gun. Its also been incredibly popular among Alaskan hunters and guides, especially in lever-actions like Marlins 1895 Guide Gun, which is compact, fairly lightweight and highly maneuverable in close quarters. 7. Show me on the doll where the handgun touched you. 4. Very difficult to do, but an absolute guaranteed instant stopper. And whatever you do, never try to approach or touch a dead bear. When I test sprayed it, there was the slightest cross wind. Since then, I have switched to a GunfightersINC chest holster. I dont know if I would call it a design. As soon as I rounded the corner I spotted a probably 900lb brown bear, not barely 20yds away. I dont look for bear but if one came my way I am ready. I am not looking to go toe to toe with a Grizzly, but if I am out bow hunting or have set down my rifle to gut a deer it is far better to have a handgun that will effectively penetrate a large animal than to scramble for my rifle if I get charged. Next to Bison, they are the second largest cause of fatalities and mauling s in Yellowstone Park. Favorites include, from top, an S&W in .44 Mag, a Dan Wesson in .445 SuperMag and a single-action Ruger chambered in .41 Magnum. 5. People arent buying snubbies in big calibers for this kind of situation any more than theyre buying large knives because they want to join that one guy who actually did kill a grizzly with a Ka-Bar. Good on him for having the clarity of mind to make such a shot, and for having the appropriate ammo in an appropriate caliber such that it could actually travel through a large bear and disrupt the spine and cause such a necessary instantaneous stop. LOL . Forgot to ask said bear Are you feeling lucky, punk. He never said pistols were 100% effective. He plainly states that he was researching attacks where pistols where used in defense. Contrary to Gun Writer Myth and continuing bullshit about the Philippine Insurrection (polite world for jack booted storm trooper war of rape, pillage and conquest) Jan Liborel found that there was absolutely nothing in the U.S. Military records that indicated the .38 Colts were any less effective than the later used 45 long Colt and little used .45 acp handguns used in the conflict. To give folks working in dangerous animal country a very portable self defense tool. Ruger chambers the .454 Casull in both the Super Redhawk with a 4-inch barrel and the Alaskan in a 3-inch variant, both of which are compact and easy to draw when things get up close and personal. No gun. Had he chosen to come my direction, theres no telling what would have happened. Did you ever even bother to check on last weeks bear attack in Florida after I said you were wrong? As a geologist, Nelson has killed four bears in defense of life and property (DLP), including two black bears and two grizzlies. They store a lot more oxygen in their muscles than we do. Some of them are like a fog. Hundreds of bear attacks? And you have no idea how much anybody here spends in Bear Country. DO NOT SEE THE MTN LIONS MUCH BUT THEY ARE OUT THERE AS SEE THE TRACKS AND A GLANCE OUT THE WINDOW ONCE IN A WHILE. I saw a buckle with a strap running through it. American Buffalo Knife and Tool Co. is adding to its line of Roper Knives with the new Sunset Series Tumble Weed. Sure makes it shorter and lighter, easier to carry and draw. 44 Magnum ammo should do the trick though! No joke, a full house 44 Mag in a rifle kicks. Honestly cant remember ever having an issue taking grizz with a 44 mag (Ruger super Blackhawk) . Note that the .38 Long Colt used in the Philipines was even less powerful than the .38 special, and US troops did in fact prefer the .45 Colt revolver to the .38 Long Colt. These two not only affect the delivered energy of your bullet but also the weight and felt recoil that you will experience. However, using a more powerful cartridge such as the .44 Magnum is recommended to ensure quick and humane kills. Grizzly bears can operate much longer that humans due to the way their circulatory system/muscles work. Over thousands of generations that adds up. of energy, and it takes a big grizzly to weigh 1,000 pounds. Anybody at all? You criticize Dean for his 30 cases, all of which are sourced, yet you flat out refuse to source your own claims. However, as far as stopping power on even the largest grizzly bear, it delivers enough energy to get the job done. This is really what the .44 mag was designed for. 2. WTF are you doing using a holster you are not absolutely certain how to operate? Make sure to have several encounters. of energy. Just try to accept the fact that handguns are the best and enjoy the show while it lasts because the rage that exists in you is going to be your demise. That means having the right gear, and knowing how to use it. Having gone on several backcountry hunts in bear territory, I am well aware of the need to carry a pistol that can be effective against grizzly bears. Sorry, theres what you read and then theres real life. That poor bear, he was just turning his life around. .357 S&W MagnumWhile some folks claim the .44 Magnum is the minimum for charging bears, many others have opted for a Glock 20 in 10mm Auto and, interestingly enough, passed right by the .357 S&W Magnum. We would like to show you a description here but the site won't allow us. You could try noticing that fact, wondering about it, and asking, Why wouldnt you choose a long-barreled gun that shoots with higher velocity, better penetration, more accuracy, less muzzle flip, less recoil, and holds one more bullet to stop a charging bear?. However, if you are dealing with an especially large or aggressive bear, you may need something more powerful. Luck by definition means the odds are against you. The second and third time I used bear spray was against overly aggressive dogs. Thats why. They have not released their data, but they found handguns to be 84% effective against bears, surprisingly, more effective than long guns. Lessons learned . From thegreatwhitehunter.com: When Reed distracted the bear from its attack on me, I had time to concentrate on the holster. Sad! .458 Winchester Magnum (500gr Hornady DGX at 2,140fps)(has 5083.36 ft lbs): 70.0 When it comes to defending yourself against a bear attack, theres no substitute for 44 mag ammo. 2 (90-5-5) alloy and size them to .430. Looking at delivered energy gives us a better idea of how the 44 magnum stacks up against other popular handgun cartridges suitable for bear defense. *** grains X muzzle FPS X inches /7000. Grizzlies may become aggressive for a number of reasons. What handgun can kill a grizzly bear? So, show us the instances that will change the percentages. In some cases, it may not even penetrate the bear's thick hide. And if you go into the North Bush influenced by Weingarten, he just might get you killed. Alaskan Grizzly Bear Attack Demonstrates Effectiveness of .44 Magnum, How to Horrify the Mainstream Media in One Easy Step, Gun Review: Springfield Armory Ronin EMP 3 9mm 1911, https://www.nrafamily.org/articles/2017/7/6/handguns-for-defense-in-bear-country/, https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/04/140415-black-bear-florida-attack-habitat-wildlife-conservation/, http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/41heavy.htm, https://leeprecision.com/mold-6-cav-c430-310-rf.html. It depends on the situation, as well as the type of bear in question. of energy. statement Ive made people really understand what to do about bears? That is a big difference. As his head sagged to the ground, I shot him three more times in quick succession, out of fear and anger. Best wheelgun, .44 Rem Mag $1195 at Guns.com Jump to Details Best Lever Gun Marlin Model 1895 Reliable, durable, chambered in .45-70 Government $1199 at Brownells Jump to Details Editor's Pick Rifle CZ 550 American Safari Magnum Popular for a reason, heavy hitting, .375 H&H $1299 at Palmetto State Armory Jump to Details Best Shotgun The 44 Magnum is a powerful handgun, but it is not powerful enough to guarantee a one-shot kill on a bear. As a wildcat cartridge, it hasnt seen the widespread use of other rounds on this list, but that hasnt stopped many guides and hunters, Nelson included, from converting Marlin lever guns for its very effective use. So, your friend may have downed a black bear with his 9, I dont think I would bet my life on one. It isnt pleasant but I can shoot the 44 Magnum one-handed and manage a reasonable follow-up shot. He includes several photographs. Craig Boddingtons new book dispels the myth that carrying a handgun in big bear country is effective in stopping a bear. But how much time have you spent in the far northern woods so far in your life? We have to do better. Why wouldnt you choose a long-barreled gun that shoots with higher velocity, better penetration, more accuracy, less muzzle flip, less recoil, and holds one more bullet to stop a charging bear? Every 1.5 pages, it tells you that youre now at the exact trail spot where yet another guy from yet another sawmill was killed by a grizzly on such and such a date. So youre absolutely not man enough to admit that you were wrong about the Florida attack, then? And as I said at the git-go, a hell of a lot of hunters have been mauled by grizzlies after they shot them. You might have learned that if you didnt try to snub total strangers over the internet and instead tried to speak as intelligently as the author just did when he disputed my claims just now. Popular among Alaskan guides and hunters, the .375 is capable of launching a 270-grain bullet at 4,300 ft.-lbs. The .44 magnum boomed in the night and the boar fell straight down, his head three feet away from where I stood. The number of large caliber rifle rounds that came out of that bastard were truly frightening. But while our hands were fresh we shot the revolver first. His father has tried in vain to get this sad lad committed to a psychiatric treatment facility for years with zero success. I forgot to mention it, and you should get credit where credit is due. 44 mag ammo for bear can be a life-saving tool, but only if it is used correctly. The full account is worth reading for anyone interested in the dynamics of bear attacks and the effectiveness of pistols for defense against bears. When youre out in the wild, its important to be prepared for anything. Like a man. The short barrel makes this pistol quick and easy to draw and maneuver, it is lighter than most other 44 magnum revolvers. .73 (2 3/4) 12 GA Slug 437.5 gr @ 1560 FPS (2363/ ft lbs): 71 No. . We have to think. Presumably he removed it when they started cleaning the moose, which is probably the worst time to do so. Dean made a claim and provided evidence, then you made a claim and provided none, and when asked to provide evidence you refused and essentially said it was up to Dean to disprove your claim, which is not an intellectually honest way of aproaching a discussion. In terms of firearm selection, Nelson said its really about delivering a few well-placed shots on target in a short timeframe. What matters more is the right bullet. Considered by many to be the most versatile North American big-game cartridge, the .338 Win. .30-06 Springfield (180gr Nosler Partition at 2,750fps): 21.8 It wasnt a challenge or snub to anyone, really. https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/04/140415-black-bear-florida-attack-habitat-wildlife-conservation/ 2. People must do that. The 44 Magnum offers several advantages over the bigger calibers especially if you pick the right firearm. No, but if he cant get his long gun out its better than a knife or bare hands (pardon the pun). Heres an excerpt. Hes in a medical field, Id really like to know if he noticed any hearing damage after 4-5 rounds of *big boom*. Oh, and the other key to using .44 Magnum to successfully stop a large grizzly bear attack is HAVING IT ON YOUR PERSON. Ruger just took a Super Redhawk and cut the barrel even with the frame extension. Polar bear attacks are expected there, and tourists are not allowed unless they carry a high powered firearm. Personally, multiple rounds at close range with 00 buck will rip your fucking eyeballs out, no matter what you are. Nelson says after about 20 shots, his wrist starts to swell and he can no longer shoot. They must have been some real badasses. I bothered to read the articles about last weeks the bear attack in Florida, unlike you. Granted, the stopping power of any pistol is low, but the nonsense in your post about the .38 vs .45 makes everything else you say not credible. The 10mm is also coming into popularity because of capacity. AK: Kim Woodman Kills Charging Grizzly with 10 mm 29 July, 2016 On 29 July, 2016, about 4 p.m. Kim Woodman was attacked by a sow brown bear at Humpy Creek. grizzly charging at 30 mph, but the .44 magnum or better it will require is going to give you exactly one chance in 2.5 seconds to hit that bear precisely in the heart or brain. Since the bear usually knows where you are long before you are aware of the bear, your reaction time may be considerably less than 4.5 seconds. For more information on how to protect yourself from bears, visit the website of your local hunting or outdoors store. Should be easy to find if they are out there. What did work was the short barrel shotgun. 2018 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice and link are included. Nelson killed one of his charging grizzlies with a .454 Casull, which he says is one of his favorite choices for bear defense. No problem. Youtubes pretty good, and even has spray vs. grizzly vids too, readers. .378 Weatherby Magnum (300gr FMJ at 2,925fps)(4,263 ft lbs): 47.0 2. The 44 magnum is no exception. I am looking forward to seeing them. https://leeprecision.com/mold-6-cav-c430-310-rf.html in Southern Cal., I have been on many gangland shootings involving the 9mm.While it does have the necessary power to kill people, as often as not, people survive being shot with this caliber.The last call involving a 9mm, the victim was shot 15 times and was still fighting us to get up off the gurney and get some payback. I am skeptical. My cousin lives in AK and Ive helped him dress a bear. Buffalo Bore produces several loads for the .50 Alaskan, including a 450-grain bullet that delivers a whopping 4,400 ft.-lbs. This holster always lives on the outside of my outermost coat. He said it was his hunting partners gun. A JSP bullet at a velocity that will completely penetrate the chest of an average-size bear is probably a better choice than a hardcast SWC solid. I stood in a dumbfounded stupor. But energy doesn't kill animals, tissue damage kills them. The cause and the effect of the .44 shot is obvious in the video. A good . Whats your excuse? Global warming? All of the guides I have hunted with insist that everyone have a bear defense firearm on their person almost at all times. Can a 44 Magnum kill a bear? For hiking and camping, I prefer a chest rig. I hunt on Kodiak. Along with delivered energy, we must also consider bullet weight and velocity. Then you have to get on target which is easier with a shorter, lighter gun. When it comes to recognizing and responding to a bear attack, few people have as much experience as Alaskas Steve Nelson, a former research geologist for the U.S. Geological Survey whos spent the last 41 years teaching bear defense courses in the Last Frontier. Such senseless killing. In this case . Holy shit you have some serious issues. . While it is extremely effective, the main reason its been so widely-used is because shotguns like the Remington 870 and Mossberg 500 are a fraction of the price of bolt-guns and, in turn, thats what the government has provided to its employees. However, the goal of this article is simply to address the question of whether the .300 Winchester Magnum is within the ideal range of suitable calibers to harvest grizzly or brown bear. Get a closer look at the Smith & Wesson Model 350, the latest addition to our #SundayGunday series. Delivered energy at a given distance, usually measured in ft-lbs. 357 Mag, and says, when it comes to handguns and bears, what matters is getting the most hits on target in the shortest amount of time. The Army even ranted against the 30-40 Krag as being ineffective. I looked in the direction of Reed only to once again see the bear charging at me. I've killed big bear with one shot (usually .338 mag) but I was also in on a bear kill with my hunting partner when things didn't go well. They must have been some real badasses.. As an avid outdoors person (hunting and fishing mostly)I love to mention and link to various products and gear I use. Smith & Wesson. Its a matter of physics, do the math. However, if you are reasonably accurate, a single strike on a vital area of a grizzly bear such as the head, shoulder, or internal vitals will generally produce a quick and humane kill. .. Im kidding, of course! What is a Threaded Barrel and What Does it Do? And sometimes folks can save themselves with a handgun. Click bait makes me so mad I wish I had a .44 magnum! If you are carrying a handgun for self-protection against black bear, be sure to practice with it beforehand so that you are proficient in its use. Clint Eastwood made the 44-magnum cartridge famous with his words Its the most powerful handgun in the world.. I see youre suddenly changing from Jesse Pinkman language to an exact imitation of Donald Trump-tweet language.Why? Youve been evasive, sneaky, and weak four times in a row instead of manning up and admitting that you said something that isnt true, that a bear just killed a man in Florida, which was a mistake. 1. Zero. Ive personally gotten black bears to leave my campsites dozens of times just by raising my voice a little, and (when with others) Ive literally run them off dozens of other times. Would I be able to stop a bear attack if it happened to me? Backpack straps and holstered guns dont get along well. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. is the standard most American hunters use. Keep your distance if possible. I agree with what you say about the .38 in a large animal. Wheres your manning-up and saying you were wrong, Hank? I had no expectation that the pistol would kill the bear. He had a long explanation for why this happens, which I boiled down to two sentences above. FRIEND HAD BEAR COME THRU WINDOW ONE NIGHT SO NUFF SAID. here: Live survive love laugh and be happy, not screaming in terror before dying in pain, 7mm Remington Magnum (168gr Nosler AccuBond LR at 2,880fps): 19.6 They should be able to provide you with detailed advice and recommendations based on the specific area in which you live. But I do know this. Who knows. The Black Magic Magnum is a 602-grain slug that carries 3,000 ft.-lbs. Yes Im sure youve read 12,000 books on bear attacks and subscribe to bear attack monthly while you work out to bear attack shows. The 9mm has 350 to 450 ft/lbs. You can carry a 9 in bear country if you want, but make sure the sights are filed down! CALLED BUFFALO BOAR AND USING ONE OF ROUNDS THEY RECOMMENDED FOR MY SITUATION AND BEARS. But they dont have sense enough to get out of the way of a truck. Im thankful that Ive never had to defend myself against anything but an overly aggressive dog. Sourced? Human beings in the woods. The article is not an argument against carrying a long gun, but a reason to carry a good back up as well. Hes an intelligent and well-educated man who honestly believes his own be-afraid B.S., but its still be-afraid B.S. Grizzly bears enter a state of hyperphagia in the fall, a condition that provokes gluttony in preparation for winter hibernation. Mossberg 500 vs 590: Which Shotgun Is Right for You? Well thought-out, well-researched, and well-said. Having shot a 44 magnum numerous times, I can tell you that it is not one of my favorite range guns. You have to do more than say there are books out there, you have to read em. Yes, the 7mm Remington Magnum is A GOOD CHOICE for grizzly or brown bear hunting, under average conditions, from a mid-range distance, with a medium grain expanding bullet, and with correct shot placement. https://www.nrafamily.org/articles/2017/7/6/handguns-for-defense-in-bear-country/ I have watched ballistic videos from a FBI training video in shot placement. The Glock 20 chambered in 10mm has become a popular carry choice in bear country. There is no definitive answer to this question as different bears will respond differently to various types of bullets. A bear is not a human and self-defense rounds are not as effective on a bear as you might expect. While not stated in the account, one of the pictures indicates the first, crucial shot, was to the center of the bears chest. Like the Spartans xiphos blade, the handgun is a much shorter secondary weapon intended for up-close-and-personal encounters. And you cant kill cancer or diabetes with a revolver. Its important to remember, however, that 44 mag ammo is not a magic bullet. All with hard cast bullets. Proper 9mm bullets yield sufficient penetration in soft tissue, but it may not stop a bear quickly enough to avoid being mauled. The biggest thing you can do to protect yourself from bears (at least in Alaska) is to respect them, their home, and their food source. Why dont you stay there. Generally speaking, though, most 44 Magnum rounds should be able to stop a black bear or grizzly in its tracks. I was awfully struck by the Santa Cruz mountains-area hiking book I read. The author carries a Glock 17 in 9mm or a Ruger in . As Nelson has seen in bear defense training, many shooters have cycling issues with the 10mm due to the limp-wrist syndrome, something that isnt an issue with a revolver and is the last thing you want to happen during a bear charge. The 44 magnum when compared with the other large-caliber bear defense cartridges is rather lightweight in the recoil department. Unfortunately, most everything else on this page is hogwash! I am thinking I would allways have a friend with me to watch my back, if indeed I was to be in a situation of a bear encroachment. Likely a happy accident for them due other evolutionary happenstances, but they are around because the weaker ones arent. .44 Remington MagnumConsidered by many to be the minimum for big bear defense rounds, the .44 Remington Magnum was first introduced in 1955 for revolvers and gained widespread popularity in the 1970s thanks to Dirty Harry. I have fifteen articles on the Alaskan revolver in my archives, and i learned something from them all. Your personal decision to sit on your ass too much. My uncle Dale dropped a charging sow with a neck shot at the same distance with a s&w 629. (THIS IS A SEPARATE SUBJECT. Despite NGs statement about black bears normally running when confronted by a human, do not bet your life on it! One thing Ive never called you is stupid. This is a website about guns, not WebMD. My Uncle Allen used a 12gauge (rifled slug) center mass at 30 feet. .375 H&H MagnumOne of the original belted, rimless magnum rifle cartridges, Holland & Hollands .375 is not only considered one of the best cartridges for hunting Africa, it also has a proven track record for lethality on large-bodied game in Canada and Alaska, including moose and bear. NOT UNUSUAL TO HAVE BEARS CLOSE TO CABIN EATING BERRIES OR GETTING A DRINK. On Thursday, 19 March, 2015, a woman with a .44 magnum stopped a polar bear from attacking Jakub Moravec, 37, in the Svalbard archipelago. of energy from the muzzle. No, Dean said he read someone elses reseach (greatwhitehunter), and he provided a link to read it.Its fine that he did so. They were attacked by a large grizzly bear . Using the Mag. So dont lecture other people about losing an attitude, make more of an effort, like I did, and youll get the facts, like I did.

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