No high pressure and in and out in less then 1 hour. But for others, it might be overpriced. TimeShare Presentation Offer: 3-Night Stay in Vegas + $50 Gift Cards Starting from $99 DDG / April 19, 2021 Las Vegas TimeShare Presentation Offer VacationOffer.com has a new timeshare offer that gives you the chance to visit the famous Vegas Strip for a full four-day, three-night stay. On a Thursday there were numerous booths open: Planet Hollywood/Miracle Mile, MGM, Harrahs, TI- and those are just the casinos we went to. All rights reserved. Universal Orlando Resort Getaway Features Thrills & Adventure. in timeshare purchases in America. Heres a variety of conditions found in the fine print to give you a sense: That said, when I attended my first timeshare presentation, the only thing they checked was my ID and which state I lived in. Kinda like a timeshare zillow/redfin. Youre on a vacation after all, dont waste half a day in a hotel conference room. 2022. I really wanted to cancel that vacation. One of the best places to find timeshare resale listings is TUGs owner-to-owner marketplace. Your website will undergo maintenance from November 9 at 10 p.m. EST - November 10 at 3 a.m. EST. If I was at a car dealership shopping for a car Id do the exact same thing. Call 800-414-1712 or Request Information Today. A majority of timeshare purchases are made during these presentations, so timeshare companies know the more people who attend, the more sales they can make. You need to book your reservation by November 24 and you must complete your stay within 12 months. So even if they dont give you the promotional items, hey at least you got something. Thank you for your patience as Club Wyndham continues to upgrade your online experience. After that, they go over all the pricing options for your new dream vacation lifestyle. Learn More, Beds: King Bed - 1,Queen Sleeper Sofa - 1, Beds: King Bed - 2,Queen Sleeper Sofa - 2, Beds: Double Bed - 2,King Bed - 1,Queen Bed - 1,Queen Sleeper Sofa - 1, Beds: Double Bed - 2,King Bed - 1,Queen Bed - 1. A Club Wyndham specialist will be in contact with you soon. Double Check that You Meet Their Qualifications, Example of Timeshare Presentation Requirements, The Sales Presentation is Required. Private Bedrooms - Our resorts offer 1-BR, 2-BR, 3-BR, even 4-BR villas so everyone has their own privacy. ORLANDO, Fla. (Oct. 26, 2021) - Hilton Grand Vacations Inc. (NYSE:HGV) announces it will report financial results for the third quarter of 2021 before the financial markets open on Tuesday, Nov. 9, 2021, followed by a teleconference at 11 a.m. (ET). The Timeshare Ploy. The spacious bathroom includes dual vanities, a steam shower, and a large jetted tub. That's a pretty decent deal considering that rooms. You can make your vacations more memorable through vacation ownership with Westgate Resorts! The technical storage or access that is used exclusively for anonymous statistical purposes. You have 1 year to complete travel from the date your certificate is registered (within 3 business days of submitting this form). You will have the right to use your timeshare unit or condominium in your home resort or you can explore other resorts around the world through a flexible exchange company program. It may not display this or other websites correctly. I am going to a vacation presentation that is 120 minutes. Download Foursquare for your smart phone and start exploring the world around you! The global timeshare market is expected to reach $40 billion in 2023. I then purchased our non-refundable flights. Redemption of points is subject to Hilton Honors Terms and Conditions and valid membership. Without a subpoena, voluntary compliance on the part of your Internet Service Provider, or additional records from a third party, information stored or retrieved for this purpose alone cannot usually be used to identify you. Make sure your information is up to date. Take a tote bag. Sponsor of this promotion is Hilton Resorts Corporation located at 6355 MetroWest Blvd, Orlando, Florida 32835. Usually when I book at a property like Hilton, once they know you have a credit card they ask would you like to hear about special offers, say YES. But thats a great idea, I should put together a post of where to find the presentations themselves thanks for the idea! Does anyone know which resorts have active sales centers right now in Las Vegas? Remember, by making this type of promotional reservation, you are confirming that you meet their requirements and promise to attend a timeshare presentation. We were actually approached by some timeshare sellers in Whistler last year. Energetic man #1 goes on about how you should invest money for traveling and leave a legacy for your children and more motivational hype to get you to realize your life sucks. The tour gives you a chance to see their top of the line suites. I dont know about now in these Covid times but there is a body snatcher booth as you enter the Miracle Mile shops at Planet Hollywood / Elara. Its unnecessary. I hope this helps if you ever get roped into buying a timeshare. As if that's not enough, you'll also get 15,000 Honors points (worth around $90) thrown in. This will be paid on a pro-rata basis and, according to Harvey, is seen as a way of sharing success. Is that correct? The technical storage or access is necessary for the legitimate purpose of storing preferences that are not requested by the subscriber or user. EVERYONE. Yup, just like a car or house, people resell their timeshares too! Yeah probably. The all in price with tax came out to $181.79. They are tastefully decorated with one king bed in the private bedroom and a sleeper sofa in the living room. 1-800-414-1712 Orlando Resort Getaway from $59 I enjoy making the salesmen work and work and work to try to force me to take their offer. Only for the U.S. Can you share some information or best practices how to said no to a t/s salesperson ? Click here for directions from McCarran International Airport (LAS). Ive been obsessed with trying to find more presentations like this!!!! You'll find a wide range of timeshare companies including RCI, Starwood, Marriott Vacation Club, Disney, Hilton and many others in addition to Westgate Resorts. Let me know in the comments below! And specifically ask if it is still valid with no purchase required. Car recommended for attractions outside of casino/strip areas, Top shows and restaurants book fast: get tickets/reservations at least 10 weeks prior to arrival. Remember what Andrew Lewis said, if youre not paying for a product, YOU are the product. -but definitely take advantage of the opportunity! If they have your stuff, youre kinda a hostage. Here is the email I received from Wyndham Vacation Resorts: Here is the short version of the terms and conditions from the email: Offer Details: Offers brought to you by Wyndham Vacation Resorts. Their opening price was almost $40,000. Shuttle personnel cannot store or hold carriers or any other personal belongings. There are people offering some real dumps. Well, unless youre one of those people who like paying EXTRA to prove a point or something (couldnt be me). Privacy Policy: Please click here to view our Privacy Policy. . Multiple Travel Windows and Limited Time Offers. our friends think we are nuts but who can beat 6 days 5 nights at an all inclusive resort on the beach in Puerto vallarta for $549.00 For 2 adults and 4 kids! But Im assuming you might not have had a timeshare property before, so Ill just lump you into the target audience as well. Learn how your comment data is processed. The freebies were the main incentive, but I also also enjoyed getting a look into new units they were trying to entice people with! Im presenting you my ID. I am going to have to try this sometime and didnt even know I could look up events for it. Top 10 Best Things to do in the Capital of the Emerald Isle, St. Patricks Day: How to Prepare for the Grand Celebration in Dublin, Ireland, Puerto Rican Food! . It looks like a nice resort to stay at and its very close to the beach. -- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.. The presenter asked where we owned, and we said, "South Africa". 17 S Booze & Bites, Wiki Wiki Stop Convenience Store, Mahana Spa, Air Conditioning, Clubhouse, Exercise Room, Lock-Off Unit, Hot Tub, Wheelchair Accessible, Babysitting Referral, Cooking Facilities, Laundry Facilities, Outdoor Swimming Pool, In-Room Massage, Sand Entry Pool, Two 24/7 Hot Tubs and Lazy River, Auto Rentals, Live Entertainment, Grocery/Convenience Store, Ok I was SO excited about this free travel hack until I saw that its only available to American citizens, haha. $50 refundable deposit required. You could try complaining to the timeshare company, but in truth since you decided to stay and didnt get it in writing that you would get reimbursed for the extra hotel nights thenthey probably wont do anything for you. The Internet Explorer web browser is no longer supported by Club Wyndham. This 27 acre master planned resort is located right on the famed Las Vegas Strip. Take care :). Tahiti Village will be over 1 million square feet with buildings ranging from 6-10 stories in height when all phases are completed. Check out the Las Vegas Destination Guide for more area fun. January 30, 2021 February 1, 2021; . Check out the Las Vegas Destination Guide for more area fun. Vdara Hotel & Spa. I asked to cancel and they didnt want to give me a confirmation of cancellation. You have up to 12 months from date of purchase to travel. Here is the link to the full terms and conditions. In 2019, there was $10.2 billion (yes billions!) This offer is valid only for residents of the following states: AK, AL, AR, AZ, CA, CO, CT, DE, FL, GA, IA, ID, IL, IN, KS, KY, LA, MA, MD, ME, MI, MN, MO, MS, NC, NE, NH, NJ, NM, NV, NY, OH, OK, OR, PA, RI, SC, TN, TX, VA, VT, WA, DC, WY. For three or four nights at a luxury property. Please read complete Details of Participation. February 4, 2021 by Tom Sumner Hilton is currently offering three nights at selected Orlando and Las Vegas hotels at a staggering $199 for three nights. For hours and any questions please call (702) 440-6851. If you have a big family and enjoy relaxing in decadent resorts with pools and other high-end facilities, there may be some value. We use the latest and greatest technology available to provide the best possible web experience.Please enable JavaScript in your browser settings to continue. Jackpot! Mmmmmm yeah, this was a good example of the timeshares turning the scam on the guest and unfortunately they usually write it into their fine print that they are allowed to do it since you were late (I would not be surprised if you were even a minute or two late and they just exaggerated your lateness). Las Vegas, Nevada. So why choose a freezing winter getaway? The food was good, the show was nice, and those 2 free nights at any hotel we want will come in handy. I am a participant in the Amazon Affiliates Program, so basically I earn a small commission if you use any of the affiliate links on this post - at no extra cost to you! After an hour, financial rep #1 stepped onto the stage and gave us a ton of payment options to try and seal the deal. The first and potentially the best/easiest is that either way, youre getting a 4 night vacation, which is pretty sweet in itself. And to my surprise, what seemed like a timeshare trap soon paid dividends. Regarding comments: Comments posted at the bottom of Travel with Grant pages and posts are not provided or commissioned by the bank advertiser. WYNDHAM REWARDS is a registered trademark used under license from Wyndham Rewards, Inc. Las Vegas, NV - Experience the thrills of casino gaming, the nation's largest race and sportsbook, and the round-the-clock excitement of the world famous Las Vegas Strip at our Las Vegas timeshare resort! Listen, they are not playing around with this requirement. Editorial Note: The editorial content on this site is not provided by the credit card issuer. I just found out about the 90 min presentation after the fact. THIS ADVERTISING MATERIAL IS BEING USED FOR THE PURPOSE OF SOLICITING SALES OF TIMESHARE INTERESTS. In this situation, the best thing to do would to NOT pay out of pocket for extra nights at the hotel and just head home and consider it a $399 vacation deal. This offer is valid only for residents of the following states: AK, AL, AR, AZ, CA, CO, CT, DE, FL, GA, IA, ID, IL, IN, KS, KY, LA, MA, MD, ME, MI, MN, MO, MS, NC, NE, NH, NJ, NM, NV, NY, OH, OK, OR, PA, RI, SC, TN, TX, VA, VT, WA, DC, WY. The offers are the same, just different locations. I attended a presentation and got a voucher for Orlando trip but I need to send a money order for $100 thats refundable and then 60 per person for taxes. Timeshare sales are big business! I do regret it a bit as it would be nice to stay up there for multiple nights! Yes. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. Please visit the resort's front desk for an updated departure and pickup schedule.Click here for schedule. Save up to 30% | San Francisco, CA. Ownership with Westgate Resorts gives you access to exquisite 5-star resorts in premier destinations across the United States. For information regarding our accessibility policy, please review our Accessibility Policy. How can watching a short video reward you with a free flight and lodging for a weekend across the country? Save 35% | Las Vegas, NV. Below is a list of some of our packages, but keep in mind that we custom make our travel packages to suit our customers needs. But companies cant just stand outside of grocery stores like Girl Scouts selling cookies and try to guilt trip you into buying something. We got offered two nights hotel accommodations, two free dinner passes, and two tickets to a show of our choosing. Just remember that you have all the power, until you sign the contract to purchase.so I never purchase and I retain my power over them. Please read our Terms and Conditions to see if you meet the minimum eligibility requirements. Any sort of wishy-washy mayyybeeees will just make them keep you longer. 5 Ways to Scam a Timeshare Presentation for Travel Deals and Freebies. 10 rentals available $93 - $729/night. on the sign-in sheet, in small print, it says: I loved doing the timeshare presentations, never once were we interested in buying. Editorial Note: The editorial content on this site is not provided by the credit card issuer. Images and descriptions depicted may include features, furnishing, and amenities that are subject to change at any time. Subscribe to The Athletic for in-depth coverage of your favorite players, teams, leagues and clubs. As timeshare owners, you can select a specific week to travel each year or you can choose a more flexible vacation plan. In the end, all the gifts cost a lot of time and harassment. I recently came to a Orlando trip and was approach with a timeshare sales rep unknowing after already agreed to attend presentation due to promotion. I mean, it might have even increased it. But what if. But can you believe there are also a ton of hustlers thirsty to give you free stuff? A Mediterranean-style vacation retreat just one mile from the Las Vegas Strip, the three towers offer exceptional views of the dazzling Las Vegas skyline, desert mountains, and the resort's lush courtyard. We say for $200, we'll do it. Phil Parkinsons side will take on Manchester United in San Diego and Chelsea in North Carolina. They didnt fly me out or stated they will give me the promotion after I attend and obtain my certification. Yeah don't accept the first offer, you can almost ALWAYS get them to offer more! So we signed up. It is a leveraging tactic to get out of buying anything. Our experience with the Las Vegas & Orlando timeshare tour sign-up headhunters is that they're open to negotiation (within limits). Leaving Sunday for a 4 night vacation. No preasure, when we started the seller asked if we were interested and the answer was No, then he said lets go for the gift. How to book the day train from Luxor to Cairo and more budget travel options in Egypt. Thanks. But I like capitalizing on free ways to travel more. The promotion was the first achieved by the club since Ryan Reynolds and Rob McElhenneys 2021 takeover. Required fields are marked *. Thank you for your patience as this issue is resolved. For reservations click here or call (800) 775-8463. The full size kitchen is equipped with a large refrigerator, dishwasher, stove & oven, microwave, and granite countertops. No sales pitch, timeshare tour or club to join. Travel with Grant has not reviewed all available credit card offers in the marketplace. Enjoy feature-packed Microsoft Office 2021 on your Mac for under $40 . Couples living in the same household with combined income of $50,000; Must have the same address on their ID; Must attend the presentation together, Single people 30 years of age and older with annual income of 45K or more may qualify, Must be creditworthy (no bankruptcies, foreclosures or liens in the past two years), Cannot be in the process of home loan modifications/refinance, Must pay 13% room tax and $20.00 daily resort fee due at check-in, Must have a credit card that is not connected to a debit account. I would also advise your readers to always negotiate these terms. Where Can You Find Timeshare Resale Listings? Vegas, Orlando, Myrtle Beach. Plus, catch the famous fountain show at the Bellagio. There is a king size bed in the two separate bedrooms, a sleeper sofa in the two living room areas, two showers one of which is a steam shower, a kitchenette, a fully equipped full size kitchen, and a jetted tub in the master bedroom. Often in Vegas, in exchange for a few hours of your time, you will be rewarded with free hotel stays or other goodies. It stated information about timeshare which I was never informed until they actually gave me the form. Regardless, when it comes to timeshare vacations, you'll always enjoy exclusive resort properties, spacious and luxurious villas and suites, exceptional amenities and you'll always create fantastic family memories! JavaScript is disabled. We offer complimentary shuttle service to and from the Las Vegas Strip, with daily stops at the Mirage and Tropicana hotels and weekend stops at Town Square shopping center. Just make sure you stick to your guns and dont buy a timeshare! *All children under age 6 or 60 lbs must ride the shuttle in one of the six integrated child seats in all our busses per NRS regulation 484.474. Participants are encouraged to listen to the live webcast by logging onto the HGV Investor . Hi ! The tour was in the 4 br suite in tower 2, which is otherwise completely shut down. Offer Expires: May 25, 2023. So we canceled. Rio All-Suite Hotel & Casino Show prices Enter dates to see prices 25,096 reviews #8 Best Value of 16 Las Vegas Timeshare Resorts "It was a rough start for sure. On the flip side, if you get an offer where you have to attend a timeshare presentation first, THEN theyll fly you out, you dont have too much to lose if you dont show up. June 22, 2021. If youre curious about buying a timeshare for up to 99% off and want to read about Best Buys check out Monicas article: Timeshare Purchases 2021: How to Get The Most Bang for Your Buck. She will be dropping her five best tips for making out like a bandit without spending a dime! The 2022-23 season will be Wrexhams first in the EFL since the 2007-08 campaign. So timeshare companies hold timeshare presentations, or pitches. Call: 1-877-288-7422 MON-FRI: 9:00AM - 10:00PM EST SAT-SUN: 10:00AM - 6:00PM EST Special Offers & Packages An Ozarks Adventure! They are owned, operated, and maintained by independent resorts, small chains, and large timeshare companies like Hilton Grand Vacations Club, Club Wyndham, Marriott Vacation Club, and Disney. And it's all waiting for you! I dont have a good feeling. Up next, lets review the Wyndham offer. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. I selected the Club Wyndham Oceanside Pier Resort and continued my dummy booking. By continuing your browsing, you agree to the use of cookies. Las Vegas will become the smallest TV market in Major League Baseball if the Oakland Athletics relocate there. Anywhere on the strip. Im really concerned about them not being honest with the cancellation and returning my deposit. Using Airbnb, hostels, or cheap hotels often has a cheaper price tag. Basically they invite you (or a group of people) to the presentation, give you ALL the pros, explain through any of the cons, and really try to sell you on the idea of having a timeshare property. Here is what the Club Wyndham Oceanside Pier Resort looks like from the photos. Heres everything you should know before signing your soul (or just 5 hours) away for Las Vegas timeshares. These vacation packages require attending a 2 hour timeshare presentation (please see the terms and conditions before booking). A little light heartedness goes a long way! THIS MATERIAL IS FOR THE PURPOSE OF SOLICITING TIMESHARE INTERESTS IN HILTON GRAND VACATIONS RESORTS IN MEXICO, FLORIDA or NEVADA. If you do not go, your credit card will be charged the full retail price of the accommodations, or a flat fee around $300, depending on the resort. Restaurant, Bar/Cocktail Lounge, Casino Gambling, Golf, Sauna or Steam Room. When we got home we did research and realized it IS a timeshare! I paid $2500 for 7 nights and 6 days Cancun vacation for 5 persons. Must complete your stay within 12 months after your purchase date. Multiple Suite Types. It is one of the largest and most visited timeshare classified ad sites on the internet with $30 million in timeshare sales, $18 million in owner-direct timeshare rentals, and one-week vacation exchanges between timeshare owners. Las Vegas 4 Days/3 Nights $ 249 Per Stay + Get 15,000 Hilton Honors Points. When you are looking for 7 Days And 6 Nights In Las Vegas, NV, Rooms101 offers great discount and wholesale pricing for only you. Located just off the lobby at Tahiti Village, it's the perfect place to explore, drink and socialize in a setting inspired by the many Polynesian Islands located 17 degrees south of the equator. Dublin Ireland! If the promo you booked says a 90 minute sales presentation, start your phone timer the minute the presentation starts. Club Wyndham Desert Blue. Interested in Vacation Ownership with Westgate Resorts? Thats because these promotions are from timeshare companies looking to introduce their resort, and timeshare ownership, to new people. Las Vegas Nevada Timeshare Resort Promotion Westgate Las Vegas Resort & Casino Hotel Accommodations Resort Preview Rate Starting at $35 Accommodations in a Standard Room with Two Queen Beds Price During Value Season Seasonal Pricing Information: Prices reflected on calendar automatically Value Season Sunday to Thursday High Season In the lobby of the Stratosphere, a group of guys wait around the casino for people interested in free stuff (like us). Monica, take it away. The first is from Hilton Grand Vacations where you can get a 3 night stay in Orlando or Las Vegas + 15,000 Hilton Points for $149. Guests must purchase by June 14, 2022 to enjoy a 4-day/3-night stay for $199 plus tax in Orlando, Florida, a 4-day/3-Night stay for $199 plus tax in Las Vegas, Nevada, a 4-day/3-night stay for $299 plus tax in Scottsdale, Arizona, a 4-day/3-night stay for $249 plus tax in Gatlinburg, Tennessee or a 4-day/3-night stay for $249 plus tax in I was very hesitant about the deal as she only inform I have to show up to a grand hotel tour and they will discuss about vacation packaging they offer and a view of the hotel. Plus use our free tools to find new customers. Our reservation is on Aug this year. Las Vegas Timeshare Resorts | Hilton Grand Vacations LAS VEGAS Make yourself at home along the world's most famous Strip LIMITED TIME OFFER SAVE NOW. Who doesnt love a travel deal? They feature one king bed in the private bedroom, a sleeper sofa in the living room, and a fully equipped kitchenette with granite countertops, mini fridge, microwave, and coffee maker. Moving to the Grandview next week. If you cant find the resort you are visiting there, check out Redweek.com, the largest online marketplace for timeshare sales and rentals. How do you talk you way out of a sales pitch? Its not like youd have a new timeshare anyway since youre just buying a specific time to use the property. Their persistence increased as they tried to coerce us with guilt and temptation to buy their timeshare at any cost. To compare apples to apples (Hilton to Wyndham), I selected Las Vegas. thanks!! Every taste is a journey. I had a great time while there. Las Vegas, Nevada, United States Enjoy a peaceful and tranquil retreat only minutes from the thrill and excitement of Las Vegas, Nevada, with the Westgate Flamingo Bay Resort. las vegas timeshare promotions 2022 Latest Inventory: (720)410-5637 Las Vegas Timeshare Example Promo #1: Westgate Las Vegas Hotel & Casino Start with a 3 night stay at the old Las Vegas Hilton (now the Westgate) just one block from the Las Vegas strip for just $99! Try a week on us. Resorts and Destinations. Seriously, if you ever want to know about timeshare vacation tricks and tips (or even what to do around the NYC Metro Area) SHES YOUR GAL. All fields are required. Las Vegas is infamous for being lined with scammers trying to sell you something. But maybe Im getting ahead of myself. Theres always a barrier. I put a deposit of 100$ just confirm my seat they also put my income information incorrect. How do I sign up to receive promotions to stay at hotels for timeshar presentations? Advertiser partners include American Express, Bank of America, Barclaycard, Chase, Citibank, Discover, U.S. Bank, and Wells Fargo. Iceland is an amazing year-round destination for nature lovers and thrill seekers alike. Tips for Planning the Perfect Winter Trip to Iceland! 3 Days / 2 Nights. If you are uninterested in buying, be stern and make that clear. I came with the mindset that I am NOT buying any of it, but my boyfriend was falling into their trap. You may be able to get an even better deal if you call the Wyndham Vacation Resorts phone number (1-877-393-8405). They were getting desperate at this point. Currently, there are no alerts for this resort. late). Cancun Ultimate Experience! Timeshare Purchases 2021: How to Get The Most Bang for Your Buck. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. I signed uip for a 3 day 3 nite timeshare promotion in Las Vegas there were many things offered for attending the sales presentation and they wanted $399 down for the package deal. This isn't going to make or break our vacation, and I guess it doesn't matter much since most of the shows and buffets are closed anyway. Is it the time of the appointment or when you first meet with the salesperson. Please give me some advice or tip would help thanks ! Here is the link to the full terms and conditions. So the point of this article isnt actually to buy anything at all, secondary market or not. You have 1 year to complete travel from the date your certificate is registered (within 3 business days of submitting this form). It looks like you need to purchase the Hilton offer by May 10, 2021. If instead you are interested in partying with those extra few hours Vegas style, Check out the crazy two night fiesta in sin city vlog. Please check back for any updates. Timeshare Promotions are an economical alternative to a family vacation; in particular, the ones sponsored by the local Timeshare companies. I have done a few timeshare presentations in my life and found it was worth my time to save $$, however, I have just hit a new stumbling block. Open Date Packages Available. Hilton has a timeshare presentation offer that gets you a three-night stay in Orlando or Las Vegas, plus 15,000 Hilton points for $199. In the last 24 hours, I have received 2 vacation package offers that I wanted to share. Advertiser Disclosure: Travel with Grant is an independent, advertising-supported web site. They didnt even check if my partner and I had the same address (we didnt), so. Timeshare Users Group (TUG), the oldest and largest timeshare owners group and advocacy organization, hits it right on the head when they say, Why would anyone buy from a resort if they could get the exact same used condo week, at the exact same resort property, for pennies on the dollar from an existing owner?.

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